Removing Safari from the App Store

Sorry, but Apple does not follow these user to user communities. But, you can tell Apple Techs directly by using the Feedback link:

Feedback - Safari - Apple

IdrisSeabright wrote:

Zurarczurx wrote:

If Apple didn't lock other browsers to Safari on the iPhone no one would use Safari on the phone and, more importantly, you'd be able to browse websites and use webapps.

What are you on about? You are entirely free to use other browsers on your iPhone. You can even make other browsers the default browser app.

I continue to use Safari because I like it.

All the browsers on iPhone and iPad have to use Apple's webkit, not their own. They are, functionally, Safari in wrappers. That's why add-ons aren't allowed on FF.

Zurarczurx wrote:

Rubbish. Safari's been getting noticeably worse over the last 12 months.

I would have to strongly disagree. Just a simple speed test on your own computer will show Safari outperforms. If your concern is compatibility, don't be surprised if a Google centric website is going to favor their own web browser (or Chromium). Could you imagine the backlash Apple would receive if their websites were not accessible by a Chromium browser and Apple told them that they test and support only Safari on their web pages.

Websites will design for their target audience, and that is their choice. If they want to reach all possible users, including those on 2.5 billion Apple devices, then they will support WebKit.

Zurarczurx wrote:

All the browsers on iPhone and iPad have to use Apple's webkit, not their own. They are, functionally, Safari in wrappers. That's why add-ons aren't allowed on FF.

Similarly when the iPhone was launched and announced that it won't support Java, web developers insisted the device was going to fail, since Java was widely used at that time. Surprise, Java still does not run on the iPhone/iPad and web developers who wanted access quickly learned to adapt. With 2.5 billion active devices where obviously a large percentage are iPhone/iPads, a web developer would have to be a fool to ignore them.

That is laughable.

If you are a web developer then you can learn more about the WebKit standard here.

https://webkit.org/

You should be well aware how browser support works and all the different technologies used for cross browser support. Chromium also does not support all the features of WebKit, so there is that. To learn how a web developer deals with cross browser support, then here is a good place to start.

https://medium.com/@dimplekumari0228/cross-browser-compatibility-in-web-design-78c9af3f9cd6

Zurarczurx wrote:

If Apple didn't lock other browsers to Safari on the iPhone no one would use Safari on the phone and, more importantly, you'd be able to browse websites and use webapps.

What are you on about? You are entirely free to use other browsers on your iPhone. You can even make other browsers the default browser app.

I continue to use Safari because I like it.

lkrupp wrote:

Safari is one of THE most popular browsers on planet earth

Rubbish. Safari's been getting noticeably worse over the last 12 months. I've contacted many companies to tell then their site doesn't work properly and the answer is always "we develop on Chrome, we test on Chrome, we don't test on Safari - so use Chrome" . Even FF with Noscript and Ublock origin breaks fewer sites than Safari. In the past 6 months Safari has started to break Google Maps and Google search. I booked a campsite in the summer and on its booking page it had a banner saying that it wouldn't work with Safari. All those sites work perfectly on Firefox, Brave and, presumably, Chrome (which I don't use). Apple is taking its usual holier than thou attitude of "the map says there's a road so we're going to drive across, even though it looks like a river and there's water coming through the doors."

And as to the OP's original point - he's spot on. Webapps on iPad and iPhone are truly awful.

As for its popularity - if Apple removed the webkit requirements from iPad and iPhone so other browsers could run a fully featured brower then Safari would have to improve or die in the face of the competition.

If Apple didn't lock other browsers to Safari on the iPhone no one would use Safari on the phone and, more importantly, you'd be able to browse websites and use webapps.

Zurarczurx wrote:

Rubbish. Safari's been getting noticeably worse over the last 12 months. I've contacted many companies to tell then their site doesn't work properly and the answer is always "we develop on Chrome, we test on Chrome, we don't test on Safari - so use Chrome" .

Yours is an excellent illustration of gaslighting that has become as successful as "google is your friend" became a while ago. Google is anything but. No one needs Chrome. Mac users, especially.

When I had a problem with a very prominent US government agency's website a year or so ago they insisted that I must absolutely, positively must use Google Chrome. Nothing else. I just as vehemently stated that assertion was untrue. Over the course of about two weeks I escalated my concern the the highest echelon possible within that organization, upon which their immovable object encountered my irresistible force. It was Chrome or nothing, not even Brave. Forget about Firefox, etc. Full stop.

After meticulously examining the website code I identified the bug that prevented it from working. Ironically enough that portion of their website would not have worked with Chrome either.

I told them. They fixed it. Obviously it now works with Safari, Firefox... anything.

The bottom line is that you are very likely to encounter that degree of resistance everywhere you turn.

Remember twenty years ago when it was use Windows Internet Explorer or go away. Now it’s use Chrome or go away. Some things never change when ignorance flourishes.

Oh and my wife writes grants and uses every state and federal government website you can shake a stick at. Safari just works. We use Safari to access our Social Security and IRS accounts, our state DMV and Secretary of State websites. Again, no issues. Safari just works.

Oops, I forgot about our banks, credit card companies, past and present investment accounts (Morgan Stanley, Stifel Nicolaus, LPL Financial, Equitable, Cetera, Regions, etc). All work with Safari. Explain that. So does Amazon, eBay, PayPal. Please explain that also.

Zurarczurx wrote:

I've got no add-ons on Safari. I run a full set of shields on FF. I don't have any such problems with FF.

That is the beauty of it, you can use any web browser that you feel works best for you. For me that is Safari and I have not had trouble with a single website that required me to use FF or a Chromium based browser. Google Maps requiring Privacy Restrictions turned off when using Safari is no surprise, their whole revenue platform is based on harvesting users data through the browser, which is blocked by default in Safari, along with the myriad of Google trackers. Right now Safari has blocked 180 trackers from profiling me and guess what the top 5 trackers are and look at the number of websites where it has been blocked.

I'm a web developer, and I can't stand Safari.

Only you can fix that.

I will save you the time of filing Feedback. The sun will rise in the west before Apple removes the Safari browser from the App Store.

There are web standards for a reason.

Safari meets them to a greater extent than any browser.

We can’t help it if you are a unskilled web developer. What blathering nonsense from you. It’s hilarious. Safari is one of THE most popular browsers on planet earth and WebKit is used by numerous web app developers.

Instead of asking Apple to remove Safari maybe you should instead take some courses in WebKit development for the 2.5 billion Apple devices in use around the world.

https://www.w3.org/

Safri is compliant with all W3C standards and out performs many browsers. Good grief, look it up.

lkrupp wrote:

Oh and my wife writes grants and uses every state and federal government website you can shake a stick at. Safari just works. We use Safari to access our Social Security and IRS accounts, our state DMV and Secretary of State websites. Again, no issues. Safari just works.

My experience has been the same. I deal with federal (and state and local) grant websites all the time, as well. Also, no issues. Social Security? No problem? IRS? It just works. Even my city's web page for paying property taxes, which looks like something out of the last century, works fine with Safari.

I admit, I didn't use to like it. I think I only started using it on my Mac about 10 years ago. Then I gave it another try and completely changed my mind. I've always used it on my phone, though.

Zurarczurx wrote:

All the browsers on iPhone and iPad have to use Apple's webkit, not their own. They are, functionally, Safari in wrappers. That's why add-ons aren't allowed on FF.

<Shrug> Google somehow still manages to turn Chrome into a mess on an iPhone.

Mac Jim ID wrote:

Zurarczurx wrote:

Just a simple speed test on your own computer will show Safari outperforms. Websites will design for their target audience, and that is their choice. If they want to reach all possible users, including those on 2.5 billion Apple devices, then they will support WebKit.

This site loads noticeably slower in Safari than on FF on my Mac. Most websites do. eBay takes an age to load images on Safari - and some don't load at all. Google search won't load with Safari because it thinks the search is coming from a bot site - it forces me to do a captcha for every search and then still doesn't load. I have to use DDG on Safari for searching. Google maps is unuseable on Safari unless privacy restrictions are turned off.

I've got no add-ons on Safari. I run a full set of shields on FF. I don't have any such problems with FF.

lkrupp wrote:

So does Amazon, eBay, PayPal. Please explain that also.

Morbid curiosity got me going so I checked. No surprise, those specific sites work just fine even on ancient Macs with commensurately ancient Safari versions.

Suffice it to say companies that actually require people to buy something for their continued existence will work.

Zurarczurx wrote:

Google search won't load with Safari because it thinks the search is coming from a bot site - it forces me to do a captcha for every search and then still doesn't load. I have to use DDG on Safari for searching. Google maps is unuseable on Safari unless privacy restrictions are turned off.

I assume you know the reasons for that, but for those who don't, if Google cannot track you they have zero interest in you. If you are not part of their business plan, then you might as well not exist.

It's consistent with Google's pathetic and increasingly desperate measures to get everyone to move to their platform. Mac users especially.

It all boils down to intransigence by IT departments that develop websites for companies. Way back in 2007 when the iPhone was introduced IT departments refused to support iOS in any way, shape, or form. Then some CEOs walked in and were told their iPhone would not work on the corporate network. The CEOs then said make it work or you’re fired. Intransigence changed to compliance instantly.

Zurarczurx wrote:

This site loads noticeably slower in Safari than on FF on my Mac. Most websites do. eBay takes an age to load images on Safari - and some don't load at all. Google search won't load with Safari because it thinks the search is coming from a bot site - it forces me to do a captcha for every search and then still doesn't load. I have to use DDG on Safari for searching. Google maps is unuseable on Safari unless privacy restrictions are turned off.

I think you have a very serious gremlin infestation. You seem to have problems with every Apple device, service, and app. That's not normal.

Falling Hare (Bugs Bunny cartoon)

Perhaps you need some Acme Gremlin Repellent.

They got fired anyway. They were no longer needed!

For some companies the final nail in the coffin was end of support for Windows XP. When they learned of the capital investment required to migrate everything to yet another Microsoft system they pulled the plug and wisely chose Apple.

Many corporate IT departments have since been relegated to replacing lost power adapters.

IdrisSeabright wrote:

You seem to have problems with every Apple device, service, and app. That's not normal.

My problem is that I don't automatically assume that Apple can do no wrong and therefore any problems with its products or services are my fault.

TLDR: you are holding it wrong.

Zurarczurx wrote:

My problem is that I don't automatically assume that Apple can do no wrong and therefore any problems with its products or services are my fault.

I think we can all agree on that! I have regularly pointed out bugs to users on this site in Apple software and even recommended returning newly purchased Apple devices when they are not working correctly, instead of going through the AppleCare process and suggested an Android phone for users looking for a feature not found in an iPhone. It seems you are coming at this with a chip on your shoulder for some reason and that is coming through loud and clear.

• If FF is what you like the best, then use it and be happy.
• I will be using Safari, and also happy.

Win-Win! Now back to the Op's topic, just because I like Safari better, I am not saying FF should be removed from the App Store, Can we agree on that one?

Not you John. It's directed at the Safari haters here.

IdrisSeabright wrote:

Even my city's web page for paying property taxes, which looks like something out of the last century, works fine with Safari.

It may in fact be from the last century 😆

John Galt wrote:

It may in fact be from the last century 😆

I suspect you may be right!

John Galt wrote:

Many corporate IT departments have since been relegated to replacing lost power adapters.

That could be a full-time job for at least a couple of people.

Zurarczurx wrote:

lkrupp wrote:

Safari is one of THE most popular browsers on planet earth

Rubbish.

You should also remember that Chrome is included on every Android phone.



Yep - and Noscript on FF blocks those trackers too - it just does it without stopping the site working.

IdrisSeabright wrote:

You should also remember that Chrome is included on every Android phone.

I also remember that Safari is included on every Apple phone and Mac

Zurarczurx wrote:

... I don't automatically assume that Apple can do no wrong

Well, something we can agree on.