qnrq

Level 1 (4 points)

macOS Tahoe — Location Services returns no fix; Wi-Fi scan succeeds but all APs unknown to Apple's database

Multiple Macs on our network cannot determine location. Time zone stays on Pacific / Cupertino, Maps spins indefinitely, Find My and Weather also fail. Affects 4 of 5 machines tested.

Environment

MacBook Air M4, pro m4, air m1 and others, macOS Tahoe 26.x, Sequoia and Golden Gate

Mixed managed (Jamf Pro) and unmanaged machines — both affected

Two independent networks tested: office (FortiAP, four SSIDs, none using _nomap) and a residential network

No VPN active, no system extensions loaded

Log evidence

Wi-Fi scanning works; the database lookup returns nothing:

@WifiFlow, aps, in, 24, cleaned, 24, usableAps, 0, maxAge, 5.0

WifiAps, querycheck, knownCount, 0, unknownCount, 24, isQueryNeeded, 1

AlsWifi, query, in, 48, paths, 0, 48, 0, out, 0

@WifiLoc, couldn't determine location

@WifiFlow, outcome, nofix

AlsWifi, seriesComplete, known, 0, unknown, 33

Every scanned access point is unknown to Apple. The radio, the scan, and the query path all function — 24 to 55 APs are found depending on location — but zero resolve.

Ruled out

Location Services enabled, including the "Setting time zone" system service

Wi-Fi powered on and associated (not Ethernet-only); country code correct

curl to gs-loc.apple.com reaches Apple and returns a response

No system extensions loaded (systemextensionsctl list empty)

No configuration profile restricting location or privacy

Firewall is inbound-only (per-app control, stealth mode); cannot affect an outbound query

DNS: overrode corporate resolvers to 8.8.8.8/1.1.1.1, verified applied — no change

No proxy configured (scutil --proxy clean)

Same OS version on working and failing machines

Location Services off → killall locationd → on → reboot

Fresh local user account

Both managed and unmanaged machines affected equally

SSIDs do not use the _nomap opt-out

/var/db/locationd cache is SIP-protected and cannot be cleared

Questions

Have someone ever faced the same problem? What was your solution to it?

Is there any supported way to determine whether a given BSSID is present in Apple's location database?

Our APs have been in place roughly two years in an area with regular iPhone traffic. What prevents an access point from being harvested — do virtual or rotating BSSIDs on enterprise APs with multiple SSIDs per radio break the mapping?

Is there a supported way to force a re-query rather than relying on cached position state?

Still testing: one M5 Pro machine reports the correct zone; capturing its locationd output to compare known counts on the same network at the same time. Will update.

Posted on Sep 21, 2026 1:40 AM

5 replies

HWTech

Level 9 (78,350 points)

Oct 5, 2026 6:18 PM in response to qnrq

qnrq wrote:

If anyone knows of another place where macOS caches location or time zone state that survives a full erase, I'd appreciate a pointer.

Are you testing the laptop with a clean OS before installing any third party software?

Also, for any managed systems you would need to un-assign them (not sure if that is the correct term) so that that device doesn't get any third party or management software pushed to that unit while testing. I know that even if I manage to reinstall a clean version of macOS without any of my organization's MDM workflows......the Apple Silicon Macs will still call home to have some basic lockdown scripts & settings installed which can still greatly interfere with a clean install. This could also include network restrictions.

Same goes for restoring the system data or any automated setups. Don't restore any data or settings, and when installing any software for testing.....make sure to use the original installers instead of any re-packaged or modified installers. I know our organization will make custom packages & installers....those may contain the problem.

Keep track if you are testing a managed or unmanaged device (or one that has been temporarily unassigned so it acts like a regular off the shelf consumer device). Or a device which has the full MDM profile installed, or one which has only been "enrolled" with the lockdown scripts & settings.

I don't actually have anything to do with my organization's MDM administration. I've just had to ask our MDM administrators to allow a device to be temporarily free of our MDM for certain repairs & troubleshooting to ascertain if our MDM lockdown is causing any problems with the hardware.

I believe you said "Location Services" was enabled as was "Setting time zone", but just wanted to be sure.

Edit: You can try clearing the PRAM/NVRAM by using the Terminal command line (this will clear all NVRAM settings):

sudo  nvram  -c

You will need to reboot the system in order for the system to pull default values. Perhaps instead of rebooting, you power off the laptop, the power it back on directly into Safe Mode.

qnrq Author

Level 1 (4 points)

Oct 5, 2026 5:28 AM in response to qnrq

Hey, my account's address got changed but I'm the author

Update: thanks @HWTech for the suggestion. I deleted the time-related preference files (Date & Time / time zone .plists) and rebooted on two of the affected laptops. Unfortunately there was no change: the time zone stays on Pacific, Closest City still shows Cupertino, and the locationd logs look the same (all scanned APs unknown, "usableAps 0", "outcome nofix").

For completeness, the same two laptops were also fully erased (factory reset) and set up again, with the same result.

On the network side, the layers you mentioned check out: the Macs associate to the access point with good signal, local network resources work, internet access works, and gs-loc.apple.com is reachable and responds. It also fails the same way on a second, unrelated residential network, so I don't think it is specific to our office Wi-Fi.

Still pending: the one M5 Pro that shows the correct zone. I'm capturing its locationd output tomorrow on the same network at the same time as a failing Mac, to compare the known/unknown AP counts. Will post the result here.

If anyone knows of another place where macOS caches location or time zone state that survives a full erase, I'd appreciate a pointer.

HWTech

Level 9 (78,350 points)

Sep 21, 2026 8:28 AM in response to qnrq

Try deleting the .plist file for the Date & Time and Time Zones, etc., then reboot the computer so it can recreate the .plist(s) with default settings. I had a laptop last year where I could not adjust the Time Zone and this resolved it. Unfortunately I don't recall the exact preference file, but it would likely be located in the main "/Library/Preferences" folder as I believe it is a system wide setting.

If you actually have network/WiFi related issues instead, then you have to separate out whether you are first connecting to the access point ( plus verifying signal/noise), followed by whether you can access local network items, then Internet related items outside the local network. Router, firewall, and any other network security features/settings enabled for the network would need to be reviewed as well as monitoring the "broken" devices for their network traffic across your network.

qnrq Author

Level 1 (4 points)

Sep 21, 2026 1:45 AM in response to qnrq

Also, checked whether safe boot would help to resolve the correct TZ – it did not

qnrq Author

Level 1 (4 points)

Sep 22, 2026 7:34 AM in response to qnrq

Thank you for your reply, I will try that tomorrow and update right after

Originally posted at discussions.apple.com/thread/256361705